Is plywood good for floors?

4mm poplar plywood too weak for floor?

Graham on 03 Jun 2019 08:26:08

Hello,

I'm currently converting an Opel Vivaro A Combi into a camper. For the floor I use 20mm X-tremendous insulator (cut accordingly for the grooves on the floor) and a plywood sheet over it. For the latter I got myself a 4mm poplar plywood board.

Now the plate is very thin and also flexible. When I tried to put the isolator and plate on top of each other on the floor, it creaked and cracked when I stepped on it. Is 4mm too weak as a floor or is it because the insulation simply gives way too much? Does it help to use spacers at regular intervals? If so, in which form?


Best wishes

Graham

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Solo rider on 03 Jun 2019 08:52:13

4mm and poplar plywood are both unsuitable for a floor.
With a floor you should use waterproof material such as screen printing plates and if you also want to attach fixtures to it, you should use at least 9mm!

Graham on 03 Jun 2019 08:59:21

Hi Axel,

I even paid attention to the water resistance, the plate is coated on both sides and glued waterproof. : D
Otherwise, yes, I want to attach furniture to it (a bed). Then it's probably time to buy a new record. Would poplar be an option again or is another wood recommended? Poplar originally made sense because it is so light, but now I have doubts. : nothing white:

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reiler on 03 Jun 2019 09:22:48

Hello,
I insulated the bottom of our mailbox with 30 mm Styrodur, then put in a 10 mm poplar plywood board and laid a PVC floor on it, holds great and you can also screw something to it
Bernd

AndreasS on 03 Jun 2019 09:24:15

So if you want to attach furniture to the wooden board, you should use at least 15mm or thicker. Should also hold ...
But should it be screwed or with superglue? :)

Graham on 03 Jun 2019 09:33:18

Haha, I think it's funny that it gets thicker with every post (9mm -> 10mm -> 15mm): mrgreen:

I'm leaning towards a compromise with 12mm right now. I would put 2mm cork over it.

AndreasS wrote:So if you want to attach furniture to the wooden board, you should use at least 15mm or thicker. Should also hold ...
But should it be screwed or with superglue? :)

I would find neither gluing nor screwing really cool, but a system in which I can detach and remove the bed and sink from the floor in a few simple steps. I'm not sure yet if there is such a thing at all, but it feels like it should be a solvable problem. : gruebel:

rkopka on 03 Jun 2019 09:52:34

Graham wrote:I would find neither gluing nor screwing really cool, but a system in which I can detach and remove the bed and sink from the floor in a few simple steps. I'm not sure yet whether there is such a thing at all, but it feels like it should be a solvable problem. : gruebel:

Maybe cannibalize a decommissioned jumbo jet :-)? They have systems to assemble the seats. And that should be easy too. Otherwise you have screwed-on brackets or the entire floor must be a special construction. If everything has to be stable enough to click into place, that usually means more weight.

RK

Unlucky on 03 Jun 2019 10:05:53

Graham wrote:... I would find neither gluing nor screwing really cool, but a system in which I can detach and remove the bed and sink from the floor in a few simple steps. I'm not sure yet whether there is such a thing at all, but it feels like it should be a solvable problem. : gruebel:


And where is the problem?
You could fix the furniture with "detachable" screws, i.e. in the metric range (M6 or M8) instead of wood screws. That means screwing a nut into the plate from below and the furniture from above. Or use "Ensat sockets", or ....

You can of course also use so-called "airline rails". Then you can also attach the furniture in different positions. : D


greetings
Dirk

Graham on 03 Jun 2019 10:06:14

rkopka wrote:Maybe cannibalize a decommissioned jumbo jet :-)? They have systems to assemble the seats. And that should be easy too. Otherwise you have screwed-on brackets or the whole floor has to be a special construction. If everything has to be stable enough to click into place, that usually means more weight.

RK


Hmm, I'm afraid the jumbo jet is over my remaining budget. : dead: In that case, screwing is going on. : mrgreen:

Graham on 03 Jun 2019 10:52:03

Pechvogel wrote:And where is the problem?
You could fix the furniture with "detachable" screws, i.e. in the metric range (M6 or M8) instead of with wood screws. That means screwing a nut into the plate from below and the furniture from above. Or use "Ensat sockets", or ....

The one with the Ensat sockets is actually a brilliant idea. So far I only thought of brackets that I could screw on firmly and then attach furniture to them.

You can of course also use so-called "airline rails". Then you can also attach the furniture in different positions. : D

I'll probably use those for the solar panels on the roof. That's too much of an expense for the furniture.

teuchmc on 03 Jun 2019 11:20:11

Mmmhhh ... Airline for a couple of solar panels, I think it's kind of exaggerated.
Or should the panels be easily removable?
Sunny continues. Uwe

Graham on Jun 03 2019 11:52:31 AM

Yes, should be removable.

wascho1955 on 03 Jun 2019 16:40:30

Hello graham

In my WOMO garage, I sometimes attached things to the floor with Velcro - but only small things. Velcro is also available in different widths and is self-adhesive

Greetings and always have a good trip


Walter

babenhausen on 03 Jun 2019 17:18:05

If I watch films like this, I would look for some ideas from vehicle fitters if I were you.
That is a crash at 40 km / h

-> link

Womofahrer55 on 03 Jun 2019 17:41:32

Graham wrote:.... For the floor I use 20mm X-tremendous isolator (cut accordingly for the grooves on the floor) ...


Hello,

X-tremendous isolator is great stuff. When gluing, do not forget to glue the entire surface (!) So that condensation does not stand a chance.

Good succeed

greeting

Peter

stoppie on 03 Jun 2019 20:51:31

Graham,

Your doubts are more than justified. It is actually impossible to fix furniture professionally and mechanically stable on a 4mm, 9mm or 12mm thin poplar plywood floor, which is supposed to withstand a rear-end collision, albeit a small one. I'm completely on Babenhausen's side. In the event of a motor home accident, your bed will fly in your neck.

Poplar plywood is not suitable for the strength of wooden screw connections for furniture on the floor, but is almost the first choice for furniture construction itself. The cardboard, uh, poplar plywood is way too soft to make serious screw connections. The screws tear out much more easily than z. E.g. for screen printing plates or beech plywood or the like.

Screen printing panels are of course much heavier than poplar plywood panels, but they are extremely robust and ideally suited for floors in motor homes.

WomoToureu on 03 Jun 2019 23:07:00

stoppie wrote:Screen printing panels are of course much heavier than poplar plywood panels, but they are extremely robust and ideally suited for floors in motorhomes.


I would estimate that 99% of all floors are made with screen printing plates. In our motorhome 19 mm thick.

Horst_H on 03 Jun 2019 23:59:17

Pechvogel wrote:Or use "Ensat sockets",

Instead of "ramp sleeves" I would rather use "drive-in nuts" and hammer into the base plate from the underside.
The drive-in nuts should be secured against slipping down, otherwise it can happen that the next time the furniture is reinstalled, the metric screws will push the drive-in nuts out downwards.

greeting
horst

Graham on Jun 04 2019 09:26:21

I read through all the posts (again) and that got me thinking. The original plan was to be as lightweight as possible. In addition, the base plate should be as thin as possible so that my head is not on the ceiling when I sit on a chair (-> mobile office). In the end, however, the plan has to adapt to reality. Safety first. I'm going on 15mm birch screen printing plate (or maybe even 18? -> link, I hope that's ok).

For the installation on the floor I have to look again at all the alternatives, especially not only with regard to convenience, but also to security and stability. Drive-in nuts are listed as an alternative.

Graham on Jun 06 2019 03:24:34

Update: I ordered 18mm birch screen printing plate here -> Link, according to information with wood from Finland. It is much more expensive than in the hardware store, but better safe than sorry. :Yes:

stoppie on 08 Jun 2019 14:58:56


weikart on 29 Jul 2019 14:12:22

Hello,

As an alternative to the drive-in nuts, I have taken drive-in nuts / screw-on nuts from the climbing area.

The advantage is that they are screwed to the floor from below and can therefore no longer move, which is sometimes the case with the usual drive-in nuts. I used them as flooring material on my Renault Master in conjunction with OSB panels and I am very satisfied. The furniture can be easily dismantled at any time. And it's very stable.

Here is an example: -> Link


greeting
Stefan

Graham on 07 Aug 2019 18:26:53

Hi Stefan, I'm only seeing your contribution now. Unfortunately, the link has already been deleted.

If you mean -> Link, that doesn't look bad, but the price, huiuiui.

weikart on 12 Aug 2019 15:37:39

That's exactly what I mean. But it is also available in smaller quantities. In your link there are 250 pieces. You certainly won't need them. 8th)

Greetings Stefan

wayfinder on 12 Aug 2019 20:39:41

Keyword: "Rampa sleeves" + dripping construction adhesive?
I am currently considering whether I should design my structure on the screen printing plate like this.
Makes subsequent screwing away and screwing possible.

Do professionals have any experience or are they concerned that they don't hold up enough?

-Wolfgang

forchh on 13 Aug 2019 09:11:00

Hello graham
you can use the thin poplar plywood for the side panels. In the age-old book "VW-Campingbus self-built: Type 2 / Reprint of the 4th edition 2008 (Now I help myself)" is described a lot that is still valid today. There they write of 12mm screen printing as the best ratio between load capacity and weight.

Greetings

Graham on Aug 20, 2019 2:11:31 AM

weikart wrote:That's exactly what I mean. But it is also available in smaller quantities. In your link there are 250 pieces. You certainly won't need them. 8th)

Greetings Stefan


Oops, got that wrong. I actually bought 20 of these nuts. With it two pieces of furniture are attached and it is good. :Well:

forchh wrote:Hello graham
you can use the thin poplar plywood for the side panels. In the age-old book "Self-built VW camping bus: Type 2 / Reprint of the 4th edition 2008 (Now I help myself)" a lot is described that is still valid today. There they write of 12mm screen printing as the best ratio between load capacity and weight.

In the end it was 18mm. But in retrospect, I think 12mm would have been enough. On the subject of side panels, the Vivaro Combi is unfortunately much more complicated than the panel van variant, so that I am currently not setting up my own side panels due to time constraints. (Maybe later.) The 4mm plates are now sleeping in my workshop.

wayfinder wrote:Keyword: "Rampa sleeves" + dripping construction adhesive?
I am currently considering whether I should design my structure on the screen printing plate like this.
Makes it possible to screw it away and screw it on afterwards.

Do professionals have any experience or are they concerned that they don't hold up enough?

I am not a professional and would just like to note at this point that everything can also be removed retrospectively with the variant I have chosen with the screw nuts.

Graham on Aug 20, 2019 02:17:43 AM

wascho1955 wrote:Hello graham

In my WOMO garage, I sometimes attached things to the floor with Velcro - but only small things. Velcro is also available in different widths and is self-adhesive

Greetings and always have a good trip


Walter


For the sake of completeness, it should also be mentioned that this proposal will also be implemented. Screwing on is good, but the boxes under the bed are attached with Velcro for the sake of simplicity.


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